To Sleep or Not To Sleep?
Published on September 10, 2007 By KFC Kickin For Christ In Home & Family
So here I am trying to do some catch up work on the computer. I have my household budget on Quick Books and am doing much needed data input. In the background is a screaming 10 month old baby. His mommy, my d-i-l, is not feeling well and my heart goes out to her. I remember those days. She came down with a cold yesterday. I remember taking care of my babies and being so exhausted I couldn't think straight especially when I was ill. So after spending the day chasing the little boy around the house she decided to go to bed early with him. I think maybe that wasn't such a good idea now because it's 10:30 and he's in an on and off crying mode..

She's a great mommy. She's doing a great job with Ethan. She's very attentive and reminds me of me. We both had our first at the same age. We both were very inexperienced with babies. Actually she's a few months younger than I was when I had my first. I was determined to be the best mom the second they put that beautiful newborn into my arms. My son, in contrast to Ethan tho, was a very quiet and submissive baby. He was sleeping well by the end of his first month. I never ever woke up with him in the middle of the night after that.

Ethan's a healthy happy baby until he isn't the center of attention, that is. He's absolutely perfect looking. He's charmed everyone he's come into contact with. One thing I think she's just starting to understand about this beautiful little boy is that he's very strong willed. He's got her wrapped, totally, and I can see she's exhausted. He's a master manipulator and is going to be just like his daddy. I guess the apple doesn't fall far from the tree afterall.

My son and she are are alone in another state with no family, so they have been at this new parenting thing virtually all by themselves. With Brian working so often, much of this child rearing is on her shoulders.

Her first week here she spent alot of time trying to cajole him to sleep sometimes taking two hours or so to do so. One night he just flat out refused to be cajoled still wide awake at 11 pm. He's in the habit of going down to bed asleep in his mommy's arms since birth. He's very big now and this is getting harder and harder to do. Big mistake we told her. It's time he goes down awake. He may cry (and he did) some but it's time for him to go to bed and for mommy to have some down time. She needs a break. She's exhausted.

The first night he cried for about an hour or so and she was a wreck. Her goal I think has been to avoid any confrontation with crying as much as possible. He lived. He actually woke up the next day seemingly in a good mood. None the worse for wear. The next night he cried again and by the third night or so only cried for 10 minutes. Of course her reaction was total and absolute freedom. It was starting to look up.....until tonight.

The bad thing is I have to work all day tomorrow so she's on her own. I hope she eventually gets some sleep tonight. All is quiet now and it's 11 pm. So maybe. But he's yet to sleep thru the night so he'll probably re-awake about 2 or 3 or so. But just maybe this crying jag tonight will have worn him out enough to make it thru. We'll see.

Maybe she'll let me have him one night, so she can get a whole night of uninterrupted sleep. Just Ethan and Nanny. I can always call in the reinforcement. His name is Papa and Ethan is just crazy about him.







Comments (Page 3)
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on Sep 12, 2007
Ethan's a healthy happy baby


Oh! How the memories flooded up reading this.

All us parents and grandparents can relate to this in some way or another.

Amanda will do just fine, and by the time she has her (4th)!!!, this will all be old news.

That's exactly what happened to my niece, Christine. She was barely 19 when she had her first baby, Joshua, a beautful rambunctious but not willing to sleep baby. Did she ever have the blues...just didn't know what to do...

I saw her last year at our family reunion. What a difference a few years make and 3 more babies. Her fourth was about 3 months old and Joshua was the doting big brother. I asked him if little baby sister kept him awake and he said no. I looked at Christine and winked and we laughed that she had learned "what to do"...whatever that was!

God bless you Amanda and Ethan and you too, lovely Nanny, KFC.
on Sep 12, 2007
as a grandma blogging about her grandson.


PROUD Grandma (dont that make you fell old KFC?
on Sep 12, 2007
Shame on you, Lula, for thinking I am unfamiliar with the book of Proverbs and further for thinking I would actually care.

I can chastize you with Scriptures, too, if you would like. It could be fun.
on Sep 12, 2007

so isn't pooping!!!! Soooooo you didn't potty "train" your little girl Karma? Geeesh

I taught her to use the potty, I didn't teach her how to poop. I didn't have her sit on a potty for an hour or more in misery until she used the potty, either.  Your comparing apples to oranges. 

You are amazingly defensive.  Why do you write articles like this is you don't expect any other view?

If your parents didn't live with you and you lived in a place with no family or anyone to help...would you consider it selfish to need some time off? Would you want other people to criticize you for it? Do you think its right for people to criticize you for working outside the home? Or would you expect a little help and advice when visiting family?

If I didn't have my parents to watch my daughter, then I wouldn't work.  Do you think that I had some "time off" magically between working full time, then taking care of my daughter until she was asleep?  You have a really interesting view if you think that working full time then spending every other moment with your child somehow is easier than staying home.  If people want to disagree with me about not staying home with my daughter, they have that right.  However, I know plenty of stay at home Mom's that spend very little actual time with their kids.  They may be home, but that's about it.  That has nothing at all to do with the debate over letting a baby cry himself to sleep because somebody says that it's "time" for them to change how they go to sleep.

on Sep 12, 2007

If you own a Bible, I'd advise reading Proverbs 14 and 15. It's about what wise people do and you have displayed that you need some solid advice in that area.

Yikes, talk about being hurtful.  This is just the pot calling the kettle black, but you are hiding behind a book while doing it.  Judging like that just doesn't seem very Christian.

on Sep 12, 2007
You are amazingly defensive. Why do you write articles like this is you don't expect any other view?


Well wouldn't you be when you get a raking over the coals here? Especially when (TW started it) most of what is being said isn't true. Another view is fine, but a bashing is not. I really don't have a problem with what you had to say really Kharma but after TW's tirade I may have thought you were jumping on the bandwagon as well. You did have an edge about you. If not, my apologies for being "too defensive."

The good news is Ethan is down and out in a matter of minutes. That's what's important. That he sleeps well and feels comfortable doing so. He had a great day today after having a great night's sleep last night also.

However, I know plenty of stay at home Mom's that spend very little actual time with their kids.


I hate this argument. I've heard it before. It's called rationalization. Even if the mom's aren't giving the kids absolute attention the way a working mom may (and how do you measure this?) when she gets home from work, there is something to be said about just having mom's presence in the home with them.

Yikes, talk about being hurtful. This is just the pot calling the kettle black, but you are hiding behind a book while doing it. Judging like that just doesn't seem very Christian.


not really Kharma. She's not being hurtful. She's trying to help her even if a bit of chastizing is in order. The older women are supposed to help teach the younger women. Although I'm sure TW isn't interested but that doesn't mean Lula shouldn't try. Lula wasn't judging her person, she was judging the fruit she saw from TW. It needed attention.

PROUD Grandma (dont that make you fell old KFC?


hahahaha I might be proud of my little grandbaby here (and his MOM also) but I'm not feeling too old at the moment. I ran 28 laps on the track today (7 miles) with the high school team and finished two laps behind the top girls and in the upper half of the pack beating both girls and guys. I'd love to challenge these young whippersnappers on here to a nice little run. Now that would make great JU fodder don't ya think?





on Sep 12, 2007

I'd love to challenge these young whippersnappers on here to a nice little run. Now that would make great JU fodder don't ya think?

You may be a grandma, but I am not challenging YOU!  I may be senile, but I am not stupid!

on Sep 12, 2007
LOL, I don't know how old you think I am, KFC, but I don't think I qualify as a "whippersnapper".

I'm certain you can outrun me. If you want to give me tips or lecture me on that, feel free. That is one area in which I am sure you are far more knowledgeable and skilled than me.

You're also skilled at browbeating people with your holy book, but I think Lula might give you a run for your money in that area. Haha.


I'm glad Ethan is sleeping well and feeling well.

You are definitely on the defensive, and I hope once you calm down a bit you will give some thought to the things I've said (however harsh they may be).
on Sep 12, 2007
You're a whippersnapper like me, TW! And I'm guessing you can outrun me, too, even with your kids.

Just posted an article about correction vs. judging. Might be way off base, but it was my understanding that correction was a very personal, private thing, and posting on a public forum isn't really the way to go about it. But now I'm doing it. Drat it all.

Well, I suppose if we hypothetically debate a hypothetical person posting a hypothetical post that may or may not have included the hypothetical phrase "It's about what wise people do and you have displayed that you need some solid advice in that area." then I would hypothetically say that that was hypothetically not very humble.

Also, it wasn't private or personal, and in no way do they have the sort of relationship where it would be proper, as shown by the response from TW.

I am probably just as guilty of this as anyone else though, and it's really easy to be guilty of it. It kind of comes natural that you want to point at everyone else so God won't look at you, you know? "See God, I'm helping the world by helping everyone else get better" when what God probably wants you to focus on is yourself and a few close believer friends and family. And salvation for the masses, but that's an entirely different ball of wax.
on Sep 12, 2007
I may be senile, but I am not stupid


hahahah but you're a GUY so you should have an advantage on me. Actually I'm not all that fast these days. Holding my own but not the speedy I once was.

That is one area in which I am sure you are far more knowledgeable and skilled than me.


oh, we found the ONE thing have we? You're going to let me have that one? Thanks.

My parenting skills are so bad, and yours are so superior. That's what you're saying right? TW, I spend more time with children of all ages and have done so for many years than you ever will....unless you become a teacher that is. You can tell me HOW you do things and what works for you, that's fine. But don't come around here and tell me that I don't know what I'm doing or talking about. I've not only been around all these kids, I'm also fingerprinted, trained and employed to work in the school system which I have done for over 12 years. I also spend alot of time in the nursery at church and around many many little children in our church family.

In fact, we have been told more than many times that our three sons are role models for their kids. One mom just told me she wanted her daughter to marry a young man just like my youngest. She's sending her young (now 11) daughter to Liberty in hopes she comes home with one like him. How's that for pride? Well it's true. So maybe letting them cry once in a while made them a bit more independent. But whatever....it worked.

You're also skilled at browbeating people with your holy book, but I think Lula might give you a run for your money in that area. Haha


oh, and another slam. You just can't help yourself can you? When was the last time I browbeat YOU with my "holy book?" Can you please be specific? Because I've gone out of my way not to discuss any such thing with you TW unless you are asking specifically, and honestly I can't remember you asking anytime lately.

You are definitely on the defensive, and I hope once you calm down a bit you will give some thought to the things I've said (however harsh they may be).


Calm down? I'm not riled. Not in the least right now. You are the one who has to answer for the lies you are spreading about me. None of which are true. Amanda is amazed you seem to know so much about our relationship and you have not a clue TW. Could it possibly be you're reading a bit too much into all this? I've only written two articles about Ethan. This one and "Ethan Has Landed." And in neither article was I "subtle" or otherwise undermining my d-i-l. Including buying him a bottle of bubbles. Geesh!

I'd love to have a nice friendly JU relationship with you TW, but not when you come here and start. I know you don't like me. You've made that plain as day. I actually hold no grudge against anyone, even when they "browbeat" me with their know it all attitudes. We all have opinions. Somtimes a bit strongly. That's ok. But don't tell me your opinion is better than mine and then go on the attack. That's not going to make for a nice friendly relationship.









on Sep 12, 2007
but I don't think I qualify as a "whippersnapper".


in my book....yes you do. If I recall, you recently called me an "old woman" so if I am so, by your standards then I would be correct in calling you a "whippersnapper."
on Sep 12, 2007
My parenting skills are so bad, and yours are so superior. That's what you're saying right? TW, I spend more time with children of all ages and have done so for many years than you ever will....unless you become a teacher that is. You can tell me HOW you do things and what works for you, that's fine. But don't come around here and tell me that I don't know what I'm doing or talking about. I've not only been around all these kids, I'm also fingerprinted, trained and employed to work in the school system which I have done for over 12 years. I also spend alot of time in the nursery at church and around many many little children in our church family.


Wow. Just. Wow.
on Sep 12, 2007
OK, I have to elaborate on the above comment. KFC, I realize you've been upset about this whole exchange. You're sure you were right, and you may well be But to put down other people as being less substantial is appalling.

You know the struggles I'm having over the idea of fellowship. I am going to tell you, plain and simple that reading what I quoted in the above post, if we lived in the same town, I would most certainly NOT attend your church, out of fear you would be working with my children, or at least instructing the ladies who do.

I like you as a person, KFC. I admire your faith, your conviction and your dedication. But I personally believe you flew off the handle with this one. Reading your comments irks ME. How do you think it makes others feel?

Your sort of judgmental attitude towards the parenting styles of those who disagree with you is EXACTLY what led to our problems with the local Baptist church. It's EXACTLY what made one of the women in the church feel she was doing a VIRTUOUS act in trying to yank our kids away. It's the kind of attitude that hurts, not the kind that builds, and it's not very loving at all. Seeing your attitude as so similar to that of the local Baptist biddies is making me believe that the attitude may very well be universal within the Baptist church. And it, in large part, inspired me to again question if the Baptist church is, in fact, a cult.

I'm asking you, when you cool down, to take a hard, honest look at this and how it represents your faith.
on Sep 12, 2007
Now...what's your problem? What's the "wow" factor?

If TW really wants the truth....like she says she's writing about. I'll give it to her straight. What she's writing is not the truth.





on Sep 12, 2007
KFC, you have no idea what my background is or how much experience I have or don't have in schools, church nurseries, children's clubs and organizations, and otherwise. Haha.

I am sure there are TONS of things you know way more than me about of which running is but ONE. See, that was the point. I'm not sure where you got the idea that I was saying that I have you bested in all but running.

Parenting isn't a competition.

I am sure you have done some wonderful things with your boys and some crappy things with your boys. Such is the nature of families.

Yes, you browbeat people with the Bible. How many times do JU'ers have to take you to task before you realize that the common factor in these disputes is YOU?

You have a problem. Maybe in real life you are a sweet, loving, supportive woman. That's not how you come across here.

When this many people tell you so, you have to realize the issue is not with how *we* see you, but with how *you* portray yourself.

If I am "spreading lies" please set me straight. Having an opinion contrary to yours is not lying. Noticing things about you and your writing is not lying. And you have certainly written more than 2 articles about Ethan. I can link them if you'd like.

PS - I called you an "old woman" in contrast to your comment about me not being a very nice "young woman". Get it? I'm not a very nice *young* woman and you're not a very nice *old* woman...
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