Hi KFC,

Yes, of course I'm saying that these earthquakes and famines that happened between 30 and 70 AD are what Christ predicted in answer to His disciples questions in St.Matt 24. They fit exactly with what He predicted, of that there is no doubt.

Now, as for what St.John says here about death, famine, earthquakes, and war, and attributing those as the signs of the future final tribulation, I agree. It stands to reason that these things that happened as a fulfillment to Jesus' prophecy in St.Matt. can certainly and was meant to be applied to or point to what we will be leading up to and during the final tribulation.


Having said that, at the same time, I see no problem with dating St.John's writing as being around 68AD (before the destruction of Jerusalem when all these same events took place while the fledgling Christian Church was going through great tribulation with suffering, and persecution, etc.) Here St.John's prophecy could very well be describing both the tribulation going on during his time and similiar events as these occurring in the future final tribulation.

The Catholic Encyclopedia states that some scholars believe the historical background of the Book of Revelation (The Apocalypse) was the reign of Nero from 54-68 AD. The preparatory vision ch. 4-5 serves as a second prophetic investiture for the revelation of God's interventions from the Resurrection of Christ to the fall of Jerusalem. Some scholars find the apocalyptic allusion to different phases of the Jewish War of 66-70 AD. This is what makes sense to me too...but I qualify that at the same time, I see double fulfillment in some of the earlier prophecy.

There is no doubt in my mind that some of the events that St.John is referring to was meant to be decipherable to its original readers. We must remember that God is merciful to these people who were undergoing intense persecution and tribulation at this time if not under Nero then under those who followed him.

So, St.John's Book is not primarily speaking of events in our own day or beyond; he was writing to also encourage and warn the people of his own time. The language he uses makes this crystal clear. He includes the repeated assertion that these things will happen "soon". Remember the Book starts with this: 1:1, "The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him to show His servants what must 'soon' take place." In verse 3, St.John re-emphasizes that "the time is near".

The contrast with Daniel's statement regarding these events should be understood to go along with this idea the time is near. Daniel is told that "the words are shut up and sealed until the end of time." 12:9, becasue the time of its fulfillment was five centuries away. The angel tells St.John, Do not seal up the words of prophecy of this book, for the time is near." 22:10.

We can't place the fulfillment twenty centuries later as that wouldn't be honest interpretation.

KFC POSTS:

I agree that for St.John, these 3 horsemen and what they signifiy are still in the future...whether that immediate "future" was the great tribulation of 66-70 AD or whether that future is the final tribulation that proceeds the Second Coming of CHrist of which no one knows when that will be. Prophecy has it that both events will have very similiar signs that preceed them from which we believers can orientate ourselves. The Second Coming will be a revelation with the last veil drawn away.

I know many people think as you that we are getting close, very close and yet, isn't that how just about every age of people felt? Seriously, all we can do is what Jesus said, be ready, keep watch take heed and let no one deceive us, and pray, pray, pray. We must arrange our life in view that any day could be our end, or 'the end' and prepare ourselves for the Parousia of Our Lord and Saviour.

A little caution is required here about understanding the terrible wars, famines and earthquakes that we are experiencing now...and those that will proceed the end of the world. Those at the end will be on a much vaster scale where whole nations will march against each other. Do you think those calamities we are experiencing today should be regarded as heralds of the end..or are these wars and natural disasters part of nature and have to be expected?

You do realize that it's very common for people of various sects, i.e Jehovahs' Witnesses, etc. to predict the end whenever the world is a tough crisis, don't you?

You say it's going to start ....."with the rider on the white horse....which is the Anti-Christ".

I can't agree that here in this verse, the rider on the white horse is the Antichrist. Yes, the AC is coming, but not in this passage, I simply don't see the mention of him yet, although I know it's surely coming.

Why? Becasue, we know of signs that preceed the AC and they haven't been met in these passages. (If they have, then please show me.) Where are the claims of some one to be the Messias for we know he/they will claim this name and mislead many?
To launch this process, this must happen that some one will claim to be the Messias.

You say it's going to start ....."with the rider on the white horse....which is the Anti-Christ".

ok so you don't like my answers thus far eh? So I'll give you some new things to think on here.

If this rider is Jesus doesn't it seem strange that He isn't named until the end of the book....and not at the beginning?

Also the word for crown in Revelation 6:2 is "stephanos" which means "the victor's crown." The crown that Jesus wears in Rev 19 is diadema "the kingly crown." 19:12. The AC will never wear the diadem because it belongs only to the Son of God.

The thought is here, that the AC by having a bow (with no arrows) is coming in peace but will soon exchange the bow for a more lethal weapon as the rider on the red horse will attest. He will go from victory to victory and finally control the whole world...much like Hitler almost did.

Also notice this parallel with Matthew 24. By looking at this you'll see that first the AC has to come before the other horses do their thing.

Matthew 24 / Revelation 6

False Christs (v4-5) / White horse rider (v1-2)
Wars (v6) / Red Horse-war (v3-4)
Famines (v7a) / Black Horse-famine (v5-6)
Death (v7b-8) / Pale horse-death (v7-8)
Martyrs (v9) / Martyrs under the altar (v9-11)
Worldwide Chaos (v10-13)/ Worldwide chaos (v12-17)

So right in Matthew with Jesus laying it all out, he said first the AC would come. He would be the final of many that will precede him. Even today, there are some that think they are the real deal. Dateline did an expose' a few months ago on one who swore he was Jesus who has returned and there are thousands that believe him and are following him around.

We would expect the AC to resemble Christ because he is Satan's great imitation.

I don't quite get your meaning by this question.

For starters, when you think of it the entire Book of Revelation is all about Christ from beginning to end.

Ch. 6 is no different. In my view, it begins with the Rider who is Christ and ends with the Rider who is Christ. Everything begins and ends in Christ in salvation history. The Book of Revelation's overall message is intended or meant to be hopeful to the Christians suffering under great tribulation of the day, is hopeful to those who are presently suffering tribulation (persecution all over the world today), as well as to those who will endure (and hopefully persevere) the final tribulation when Satan is loosed just before at the end of time.


In this sense, St.John transports us from the tribulation of 70AD to the tribulation just before eternity by beginning with the events just as Daniel's 70 week and then extends his outlook to the final eschaton. As his visions progress, he uses anticipation.

The technique of anticipation starts with the seals, next will be the trumpets, then the dragon, etc. With the first seal, the Rider of a white horse appeared, like the marriage supper of the Lamb, was a promise of later hope. At the end Ch. 19:11, 13, 16 He reappears---"I saw Heaven opened, and behold, a white horse! He who sat upon it is called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judge and makes war...The name by which He is called is THe WOrd of GOd..on His robe and on His thigh He has a name inscribed, King of kings and Lord of lords."

This dovetails perfectly with Daniel's Son of Man, and with the words of Christ in St.Matt. 24 and both of these refer to the destruction of Jerusalem and of the Temple in 70AD. The rider symbolizes Christ's victory over the Sanhedrin.

Daniel's prophecy was that the "Son of man" would come in the clouds in judgment and this was fulfilled by the destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple in 70AD, Christ prophecied the destruction of Jerusalem in St.Matt. 24.

Now let's connect it all since you brought up Christ being named at the end of the book....

19:15, The sword coming out of His mouth is a symbol of the eternal Truth He speaks and embodies. That's the battle strategy of the Lamb. The truth of the word of GOd is so powerful that it conquers the physical kingdoms and breaks the dragon's power over people's minds. This is the "stone" of Daniel that crushes the statue (Dan.2:45). This is the "Son of man" coming to judge Dan. 7:13; St.Matt. 24:30) This is the breaker of the scroll's 7 seals Apoc. 5:9. This is the Child who will rule with a rod of iron". Apocl 12:5. This is the treader of the "winepress of the fury of the wrath of God" Apoc. 14:20. This is the nemisis of the dragon and its 2 beasts.

Here is the hope of the Book of Revelation (The APocalypse): Christ's victory is inexorable because His weapon is Truth. I think St.John makes it clear that the rider on the white horse "will tread the winepress of the fury of the wrath of GOd the Almighty." Apoc. 19:15.

Christ's prediction in St.Matthew 24 was fulfilled. (I'll go over that in a separate post, if need be.) That was Daniel's 70 week and earthly evidence that Daniel's prophecy was fulfilled while CHrist was in Heaven where He was given dominion. Remember, KFC, that Christ Himself applied this prophecy of Daniel to Himself in His trial before the Sanhedrin St.Matt. 26:64? He told the priests who were conducting the trial that they would see this occur. He promised that "this generation will not pass away till all these things take place." St. Matt.24:34-35.

His coming on the clouds here is not His Second Coming, but it is His predicted coming on the clouds to judge the Sanhedrin. He judged them with the desolating deeds of the Roman army under Titus in 70AD. There was great tribulation at this time with the signs you mention above.

The visions of the Apocalypse begin and end with the white-horse Rider. The first seal reminds the Christian community that even though there is much suffering to undergo first, the final outcome is assured. St.John wants us to be absolutely certain that Christ kept His promise; the final outcome is assured and that we can endure in the assurance that He will come again.

I don't quite get your meaning by this question.For starters, when you think of it the entire Book of Revelation is all about Christ from beginning to end.

well of course. The whole bible is about Christ from beginning to end, but it doesn't mean every character mentioned is Christ. This rider is not Christ just looking at it all logically. You are insisting he is, and the only thing you can go on is the white horse. The rest doesn't add up and that's why many believe this is not Christ but the anti-christ. Notice how he's named (as you wrote above) and compare it even with Chap 6. They don't even sound alike....other than the white horse that is. It's deception that's why.

The rider symbolizes Christ's victory over the Sanhedrin.

HUH? You can make it anything you want if you wish. But it doesn't make it so. Where do you get this from? Think logically. The White Horse comes first. Then comes war as a result of the first horse, then comes famine as a result of the second horse, then comes death as a result of the third horse. Go to Matthew 24 and you see the same sequence which is what Christ is warning us to watch for. This is at the end of the age he said. Also you have to ignore the fact that Christ is the one opening the seal here in Revelation. He opens each one and a command is issued by one of the angels. An angel is NOT going to COMMAND Christ to COME. It makes no sense especially in lieu of what was just announced after the great worship service in Chap 5.

Now look at the crowns. Two different crowns are mentioned because these are two different personalities each wearing their crown. Look at their weapons. Christ ALWAYS has a SWORD. This rider (the AC) is brandishing a bow with no arrows. He's coming in peace just before war breaks out because it's a false peace just like Christ foretold in Matthew 24.

It all makes sense Lula. To say otherwise you have to ignore logic and grab onto symbols and make it whatever you wish it to be.

Daniel's prophecy was that the "Son of man" would come in the clouds in judgment and this was fulfilled by the destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple in 70AD, Christ prophecied the destruction of Jerusalem in St.Matt. 24.

Actually there are at least two cults I'm aware of that believe that Christ came back in the clouds as well but more recently after they messed up predicting the end of the world. they got the dates wrong but now believe that he really came back in the clouds and is working on our behalf...doing something...I can't remember what. This was all done to save face for predicting (more than once) the second coming. So now, it's "well he came, and we were right, but he came invisibly in the clouds." So you're not alone here.

of course we've been over this before. I don't agree here with ya!! It doesn't dovetail with scripture at all. Remember Acts 1? You agreed remember? He will come back the same way he left....visibly with the clouds just like it said in Acts 1. Not hidden and secret.

See what you're doing Lula, is you're symbolizing this by making it or trying to get it to fit, but you are going to run into scriptural problems when you do it this way. When he said he's coming back visibly.....I believe it to be true. He never said he was coming back in the "clouds of judgment" anywhere. So not sure where you're getting that from. When he comes back we will all know it. Jerusalem was destroyed many times. This was not the only time.

So now we know how each one of us takes this passage. We should tuck this away and see how it fits with the next section which I'll do when I get back.

I've never heard of Jesus with a bow. The armor of God has a sword, not a bow. Why would Christ wear any armor but the armor of God?

Yes, Jythier, good point!!

KFC POSTS:


And I could say the very same back to you...Antichrist is the rider of the white horse is you trying to get it to fit with the Rapturist theory. According to your interpretation of 4:1, the believers have already been "raptured" ...and now according to the theory..Antichrist and the great tribulation must follow; that is it will occur during the 7 years immediately following the secret “rapture”.

But is that what the text teaches? Does this text point to the Antichrist? I don't see that it does and here's why...

and it’s more than the fact that it's a white horse. It's Scripture that points out the Rider is Christ. When Daniel's 70th week prophecy of the Son of man coming on the clouds as Victor is put together with Christ's prophecy (referring back to Daniel) in St. Matthew 24, we can understand that St.John is describing Christ as victor on the white horse.

I shall tie it all together which should explain why Christ is the Rider. Is it possible that apocalyptic language can use one image to symbolize 2 realities?

Let’s go back to St.Matt. 24 by first understanding what just has happened in Ch. 23, the 7 woes where Christ indicts the scribes and Pharisees for their vices. In v. 36, the chapter ends by Christ saying, “Truly, I say to you , all this will come upon this generation.” Note the word “this” and “this generation” as it’s very important in understanding it’s not about the future final tribulation or about the Antichrist. In v. 37-39, Christ admonishes Jerusalem big time for killing the prophets and stoning them. He tells them Jerusalem is forsaken and desolate. Why? because the holy city has resisted all the unique graces offered it.

Then we read St.Matt. 24 where Christ has just left the Temple when His Disciples came and pointed the Temple out to him and He told them every stone on the Temple would be thrown down. The disciples ask 2 questions. “Tell us when this will be and what will be the sign of Your coming and of the close of the age.” 24:3.

In response Christ predicts 8 signs warning the early Christians when to flee to the mountain to prevent the decimation of His fledgling Church when Jerusalem’s Temple is destroyed.

So here, Christ gave various signs to warn His followers of a tribulation about to break over them. Those signs would be the ones you cited in St.Matt. 24. They are the appearance of false messiahs,v. 4-5, wars and rumors of wars v. 6, famines, earthquakes v. 7, persecution (Great Tribulation) v 9, ; apostasy v. 10-12; Daniel’s desolating sacrilege v. 15-19. Christ states, “There will be great tribulation, such as has not been from the beginning of the world until now, no and never will be. And if those days had not been shortened, no human being would be saved, but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened.” St.Matt. 24: 21-22. Daniel’s vision 12:1 speaks of severe tribulation during the reign of Antiochus, and now Christ states there’s going to be the greatest tribulation, far worse than that of Antiochus. Those who follow the Rapture theory believe this has not yet been fulfilled but St.Matthew argues against this.

Jesus is speaking to His followers elaborating on the 8 signs, warning them that they are soon to be in an intense battle for survival. (Those signs were fulfilled in 70AD. The Great Tribulation of His Church in v. 9 occurred under Nero (Antichrist type) from 64-70AD.)

And then in the middle of this He promises the coming of the Son of man within a generation by saying, “they will see the Son of man coming on the clouds of Heaven with power and great glory...Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away till all these things take place. 24:30, 34.

How do these texts dovetail with Christ being the rider on the white horse? How is St. John’s Christ as Victor connected to Daniel and this passage of St.Matthew?

Daniel 7:13-14, tells us that “with the clouds of Heaven there came one like a son of man, and he came to the Ancient of Days, and was presented before Him. And to Him was given dominion and glory and kingdom, that all peoples, nations, and languages should serve Him, his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away and His Kingdom one that shall not be destroyed.”

So here in the prophecy of Daniel and St.Matt., the Son, Christ (as Victor) is traveling in the clouds to His Father (the Ancient of Days) in Heaven, seated at His right hand, for the bestowal (given dominion) and glory of His Kingdom. In other words, Christ, because of His Cross, is recognized as Victor over sin and death.
Jesus, during His trial before the Sanhedrin, applied this prophecy to Himself. St.Matt. 26:64, He said, “I tell you, hereafter you will see the Son of man seated at the right hand of Power and coming on the clouds of Heaven.” Here Jesus told the men judging Him they would see the coming foretold by Daniel. Some undeniable evidence of the Son of man’s victory must be seen and must have occurred within the generation of the Sanhedrin. The lifetime of the Sanhedrin overlaps with the time from of Daniel’s vision and the public event that the Sanhedrin would see when Jesus was the spiritual Victor over the Old Covenant and it’s leadership in the days of Nero occurred in 70AD when Jerusalem and the Temple was destroyed by the Roman army. Jesus told the Sanhedrin that they would see the day when He would come and judge them.

This isn’t the Second Coming and all these signs of the Great Tribulation in St.Matt. proceeded the destruction of Jerusalem and Temple in 70AD. Christ came on a cloud while in Heaven at the right hand of His Father and judged Jerusalem in 70AD. The public event which evidenced the coming of Christ in Victory was the destruction of Jerusalem as instigated by the little horn, Nero aka the Antichrist type. It was a public judgment that proved Christ was Victor in Heaven over His enemies on earth.

From this we understand that a conquering army around Jerusalem ended the 7 years of Great Tribulation, persecution by Nero, famine, war, earthquakes, would all fulfill the Son of man prophecy of Daniel’s 70th week 9: 24-27 as expanded by Christ in St.Matt. 24.

These parallel events between Heaven and earth is what we see covered in the Book of Revelation, The Apocalypse.

Christ is the Victor.
Christ reigning in Heaven is Victor.
Christ is the victory Rider on the white horse and at the same time the victorious judgment of Christ in Heaven as evidenced in the event of 70AD (now part of history), certainly point to a final prophetic event.

In my view this can't be the 7 year Great Tribulation because that already occurred thus fulfilling Daniel’s prophecy.

Even though the interpretations of these visions have been argued over the centuries and will continue as they are right here with us, we can appreciate St.Gregory who said, “Scripture transcends all other sciences by the way it uses one and the same discourse to tell history and reveal mystery.”

KFC,

I have a favor to ask of you. Can you please email me at: Justice42@centramedia.net? )Your old email addy was in the gmail account that got stolen).

So, Lula, Christ came again to judge Isreal, but it wasn't the Second Coming?

This is a logical question. No, Christ didn't "come again" when He judged Israel. After He had ascended into Heaven in the clouds toward His Father, from there, He judged Israel with the Roman army of Titus. That's how we speak of events from between Heaven and earth.

Let's go over it. Because we firmly believe in the Second Coming when Christ comes again to judge, we tend to automatically assume that any passage that speaks of Christ's coming always refers to that Blessed Hope of His Second Coming at the final eschaton. At that time, Christ will come again in the clouds, but then He'll be traveling toward earth to judge all mankind.

Christ said that Daniel's Son of man would come in judgment during the Sanhedrin's generation. We have 3 choices at this point. We know Jesus wasn't lying or that He was mistaken about His timing so that leaves that the "coming" in judgment of Daniel 7 and Matthew 26 occurred before the close of the first century AD and this prophecy has already been fulfilled.

Christ judged Jerusalem with the ROman army in 70AD. He predicted it, "For the days shall come upon you, when your enemies will cast up a bank about you and surround you...they will not leave one stone upon another in you becasue you did not know the time of your visitation." St.Luke 19:42-44. From this we know that Jesus fulfilled Daniel's SOn of man prophecy while in Heaven.

So, Daniel's event and prophecy is thousands of years (and counting) before Christ's Second Coming.

Jesus told the Sandhedrin that they would see evidence of the coming of the Son of man as predicted in Daniel 7:13. Yet, those who believe in the Rapture place the second half of Daniel's vision in the future even for our time. This is to justify a still future 7 year Great Tribulation. This isn't Scriptural becasue for that to happen the Rapturist is forced to believe
that on the eve of His Crucifixation, Jesus made a promise to the Sanhedrin, but His timing was off by at least 2,000 years!!! That's why noting the word "this" and "this generation" is so important in understanding this prophecy.

Christ said that Daniel's Son of man would come in judgment during the Sanhedrin's generation

That's why noting the word "this" and "this generation" is so important in understanding this prophecy.

but you're making assumptions here. You're assuming he's meaning THAT generation standing is the one he's talking about. He could also be talking about the generation that will see these things will also be the generation that will see his second coming...which will be in judgment (not 70AD).

Now looking at Luke 19:42-44 I agree it's talking about 70AD there. No question. Notice v42 says ......"If thou had known even thou at lease in this THY DAY, the things which belong unto thy peace! but now they are hid from thine eyes."

He's talking about the 69th week. This is the end of the 69th week that Daniel foretold about the Messiah being cut off. Here Christ was weeping over Jerusalem knowing that he came for his own, and they accepted him not. He's about to die here.

There is nothing about "this generation" here at all. That is in Matthew 24:34 and says in the middle of a passage there:

"Verily I say to you, "this generation shall not pass till all these things be fulfilled."

He's speaking of a parable and then he speaks about the generation that will see this happen. They will see the start, middle and finish of it. He's not talking about those living then. The Greek word can mean "race" or "family" as well which makes good sense here, i.e. the Jewish race will be preserved in spite of terrible persecution when the Lord comes. You're assuming it means that particular generation standing. Obviously it can't be because these things didn't happen yet. When did "lightening coming out of the east and shines to the west so shall the coming of the Son of man be happen?" V27

Antichrist is the rider of the white horse is you trying to get it to fit with the Rapturist theory. According to your interpretation of 4:1, the believers have already been "raptured" ...and now according to the theory..Antichrist and the great tribulation must follow; that is it will occur during the 7 years immediately following the secret “rapture”.

NO, this has NOTHING to do with the rapture. So that's not correct. Actually 4:1 is pre-trib but we're in Chap 6 now so this has nothing to do with the rapture at all and I'm not totally sold on pre-trib. Mid-trib or "pre-wrath" may even make more sense.

And then in the middle of this He promises the coming of the Son of man within a generation by saying, “they will see the Son of man coming on the clouds of Heaven with power and great glory...Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away till all these things take place. 24:30, 34.

exactly, that's why it CAN"T be the generation then, but HAS TO be the generation still future. The same generation that sees these things happen (24:4-28) will be the same generation that will see the Son of Man coming in the clouds of heaven. That's why it CAN'T be past, but HAS TO be future. In a 7 year period this is easily well done, with or without the rapture belief.

I have a favor to ask of you. Can you please email me at: Justice42@centramedia.net? )Your old email addy was in the gmail account that got stolen).

done Gid. Now looking forward to hearing from ya!

lula posts:


KFC, the only way this HAS To be the generation still future is for the Rapture theory to hold. According to Rapture theory, Daniel's 70th week which is Christ coming in the clouds in judgment hasn't been fulfilled yet and will occur in our future. In order to accomplish this, Rapture theory puts a 2,000 plus time span in between Daniel's 69th week, (Christ's death) and his 70th week which is when the Son of man comes on the clouds in judgment. I'm saying this prophecy in St.Matthew describes Daniel's 70th week to a "T", and that has already been fulfilled in 70AD, God's judgment on Israel through the Roman army.




Assumptions you say.

There is no doubt that St.John's Book of Revelation is closely tied with the Book of Daniel. In my view, where Daniel's prophecy ends (the 70th week being fulfilled in 70AD with the destruction of Jerusalem), St.John's begins. I've just shown in reply #38 how St.John's Rider is Christ, the Victor, by tieing our Lord's prophecy in St.Matt 24 in which He quoted Daniel's "Son of man" coming on the clouds in judgment. To me, Daniel's prophecy has already been fulfilled by Christ, as Victor, coming in the clouds in judgment at the destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple in 70AD.

To me, Daniel's 70th week has already been fulfilled and is now history...and that blows a big hole in the Rapture theory.

I tend to agree with those biblical scholars who say that St. Matthew most probably regarded the denunciation of the scribes and Pharisees in Ch. 23, and the eschatolgical discourse in chapters 24 and 25 as a single unit. This ties in well with St.Mark who btw also quotes Daniel 7:13, the Son of man coming in judgment.

As you know, St.Matt. 24 is the discourse between Christ and His disciples that begins with Christ telling His disciples that every stone on the Temple would be thrown down. Now such a catastrophe as the destruction of the Temple to their minds could only happen as part of the end of the world. They see the end of the Temple and the end of the world as coinciding. And so, the disciples ask 2 questions. “Tell us when will THIS be (meaning when the Temple will be thrown down) and what will be the sign of Your coming and of the close of the age.” 24:3.

The rest of the chapter tells how Christ answered these questions and ends by warning them (and us) to be watchful and pray. Throughout the discourse, 3 prophecies are interwoven---1--the destruction of Jerusalem by the invading armies of Titus in 70AD---2--the end of the world---3--the Second Coming of Christ .

Each of the 3 events have characteristics of their own and Christ describes the signs preceeding these. It’s easy to confuse the signs and times of the destruction of Jerusalem and those of the end of the world and of the Second Coming. It’s not surprising at all given that the destruction of Jerusalem itself symbolizes the end of the world. Our Lord speaks here very much like in style and language of the prophets who announced the future events without specifiying the order in which they would happen. We’ve also seen that apocolyptic language with its profusion of symbols and images is not all lined up in chronological order. Every prophecy about the future seems quite obscure at first, but as events unfold, especially with actual history behind us, everything fits into place.

The Old Testament prophecies were not well understood until they were fulfilled during Christ’s First Coming; and NT prophecies will not become clear until His Second Coming.

We know the Temple was standing when Jesus spoke this prophecy and even when St.Matthew wrote his Gospel account in 50AD, right? In Rev. 11, St.John writes of Jerusalem and its Temple as though they are still standing and functioning. He’s instructed to measure the Temple and its altar. It’s not referred to as the former Temple, nor is there any reference to its past destruction or the future rebuilding of a third Temple and it’s not referring to the heavenly Temple either.

These are just some of the reasons why I see that these signs which Christ reveals refer to the then-coming destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple in 70AD; that they apply to the Jews then living during the generation (within 40 years) of Jesus.

As for wars and rumors of war, Christ explains they must come to pass and doesn’t imply that the end of the world is imminent v. 6. Wars aren’t a sign of the end, but only the normal course of judgmental events God brings to the earth.

I used to be a proponent of the view that St.John wrote the Apocalypse around 95-96 AD, however, after researching, I’ve changed my mind. I found that Irenaeus (Against Heresies) and Eusebuis (Church History) are lone witnesses and many references that their research was ambiguous.

Either way, I deduce that the entire NT was written prior to 70AD, since there is nothing to the destruction of Jerusalem or that the Jews had been judged, destroyed and dispersed by Titus’ army. The references to events in The Apocalypse which are said to “shortly come to pass” suggest the destruction of Jerusalem (1:3; 19; 22:7, 10, 12, 20) and that much of the Book would have been fulfilled in the first century.

I know that many, including you, think the Apocalypse was written about 95-96AD well after the destruction of Jerusalem and interpret the signs and these events as all being fulfilled in the future.