It's going to get better
Published on July 19, 2006 By KFC Kickin For Christ In Current Events
Israel. They are forever it seems the center of the news. Israel is the center of biblical history and prophecy and as we can see quite clearly, current events. I believe there is a reason for this.

Our Pastor asked a question on Sunday. How can we show that God's word is true? Many answers could be heard from the congregation but not the one he wanted. The answer? Israel. He said Israel's survival is the best testimony of the word of God. From the beginning of the OT history Israel's future was prewritten. The prophets prediicted not only Israel's possession of the land but also her unparalleled suffering and dispersion throughout the whole earth, her eventual repentance and then finally her last days restoration...which has not totally happened yet.

"Thus says the Lord, which gives the sun for a light by day and the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night.....if those ordinances depart from before me then the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me forever. If heven above can be measured and the foundastions of the earth searched out beneath I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, says the Lord." Jeremaih 31:35

This was written in 500-600 BC and as we can see still true. Israel is still here. Even tho they were scattered for the better part of 2000 years not coming into their own until 1948 when Israel was declared a homeland for the Jewish nation. And they came. From all over the globe as it said they would in Ezek 37 as dry bones that have come back to life. It says there

Come from the four winds ...and breathe upon the slain that they may live....and the breath came into them and they lived and stood up upon their feet so exceeding great army. ....I will open your graves and cause you to come up out of your graves and bring you into the land of Israel. And you shall know that I am the Lord....and I shall place you in our own land and then you shall know that I am the Lord have spoken it and performed it. .

This is prophecy that we've all seen in our lifetime. It hasn't been easy but for Israel to be in this land is nothing more than miraculous. It's an awesome time for any that believe in the promises of God. This goes all the way back to Abraham where God said...I will make you a great nation and I will bless you and make your name great and you shall be a blessing and in you shall all families of the earth be blessed. Gen 12

Israel is a fossil civilization. Where are all the other peoples of the OT? Gone. They have been assimilated into other cultures long forgotten. The Jewish people comprise about 1/4 of 1% of the world's population. In other words one out of every 370 people presently living is Jewish. In the US the population of Jews comes to about 2%.

The astounding influence of this relatively small group of people in politics, law, science, medicine, journalism, economics, labor, the arts, the media, etc cannot be overstated. This can be quickly illustrated by the fact that as an identifible group they have won more Nobel prizes thn any other people group.

Mark Twain wrote of the Jew:

He could be vain of himself and not be ashamed of it. Yes he could be excused for it. The Egyptian, the Babylonian and the Persian arose, filled the planet with sound and splendor, then faded to dream-stuff, and passed away; the Greek and the Roman followed and made a vast noise and they are gone; other peoples have sprung up and held the torch high for a time; but it burned out and they sit in twilight or have vanished.

The Jew saw them all, beat them all, and is now what he always was, exhibiting no decadence, no infirmities of age, no weakening of his parts, no slowing of his engeries, no dulling of his alert, agressive mind. All things are mortal but the Jew; all other forces pass, but he remains. What is the secret of his immortality?


I believe the secret to his immortality can be traced to that unconditional covenant God made with Abraham, the father of the Jewish people. It's not a secret that the Jews are pall bearers in their enemies' funerals. They are receiving special protection and will continue to do so as we understand the prophecy written for them.

This is exciting times for the Jews and all those that are believers in the promises he made not only to the Jews but those that are supporting them. Whoever blesses Israel God will bless. He said so, and we here in the US are a testimony of that. God has indeed blessed us beyond measure. I am very thankful that others are trying to get into this country not out of it. What do they see? I believe they see God's blessing and hand upon us.




Comments (Page 2)
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on Jul 21, 2006
Like I said, call it a blind spot in my biblical knowledge if you want, but end of times prophesy is a waste of time even if you can stomach believing it. I think you'll find the general beliefs of most Christians take the book of revelations, and the oddities of many people's interpretation of such, with a grain of salt. They don't want to ban such, they just roll their eyes at it and edge away uneasily.


I agree. Sure, it is fun to talk about, but as with most other debates that get Christians heated, it's really not that important. God will come when and as He pleases, and knowing His exact methods won't help us with the Great Commission.
on Jul 21, 2006
Just to chime in...actually I've ALWAYS heard of the 144,000 Jewish witnesses. Not 144,000 total saved....the only place I ever heard that was from JWs.


Thank you.

Actually Baker the 144,000 Jewish witnesses is very mainstream. They are servants of God sealed during the tribulation period. I've known about this since I was a kid. Oh and btw it's different with the JW's. They think they are the 144,000. But it's clearly(with each tribe mentioned by name) the Jews.

but I can't say I've bothered to sit through many revelations sermons, either


there ya go!!! That's why you haven't heard this. But then again you just said you have???? Which is it?


I've seen too many 'prophets' who spent all their time pondering what was going to happen and never bother noticing what is going on with people five feet away


ya, I know....but there is a time and place for everything. I was a JW once....believe me I know. Did you know that Revelation is the only book in the bible that promises a blessing if you read it? 1:3

No offense, but if you think evangelical Christians who believe in the revelations version of the end of the world are mainstream, well, you need to venture into the mainstream a bit more


none taken......actually I've been involved in mainstream and not so mainstream. What is your definition? It was the non mainstream that were really into the bizarre beliefs about Revelation. The mainstream is more concerned about our daily living and walk with God, how we treat our neighbor and such. But that doesn't dismiss talking from time to time about end times tho. In fact most of the NT is either dealing with the first coming or the second coming. Much is said to be watchful and alert for we don't don't when he'll be coming back. But he will and when we least expect him.

There are 190 million or so people who profess CHristianity in the US, and the 30 million or so that have bought the first book don't account for the mainstream. Lehay's foisted about 65 million books the world, sure, but that's with what, 14 books now?


People are very interested in this subject...naturally so. Non Christians and Christians alike from my experience. I'm not sure how many of LaHaye's books were sold. But I know our library has them so many don't have to go out and buy them. I heard on the radio once someone on a plane saw dozens of people reading his books when they first came out. I read some of them and found them to be fair in their representation of Revelation in a fictional sort of way.

My reading of that is that God didn't want the Jews to understand anything of heaven above (the sky?) or the foundations of the earth below. Doesn't that mean that mining and cosmology have damned the Jewish people?


Hi Cacto, ...................so are you saying that we can measure the universe and the earth below?

on Jul 21, 2006
P.S. Sorry to address you off-topic here, but Aeryck has blacklisted me and I can't reply on his blog. I generally don't come down hard on people who believe in the inerrancy of the Bible in daily life. If the belief that the Bible is inerrant just effects you, then by all means it is none of my business.

In discussions on particular topics like evolution and capital punishment, though, people use the Bible as an authoritative reason behind why think think things that pertain to me and my nation should change. In that light, you'd better darn well be able to PROVE that it is authoritative. When people want to impose their interpretation of the Bible on politics,, I hold their arguments to a higher standard that the Bible simply doesn't fulfill.

You say it is my "belief" that the Bible isn't inerrant. Well we have to have reasons to suppose a particular object is divine when no other objects are. If I were to say my shoes were holy relics, you'd demand some sort of proof, wouldn't you? What if the divine nature of my shoes was espoused by enough people to effect your day-to-day life, even if you don't believe it?

Again, sorry to address this here, but I can't there. I just think you'd have a problem if our national policy on terrorism was based upon someone's belief that the Koran was inerrant. The fact that you posted this one in current events makes me believe this goes beyond "belief" i.e. religion for you.

P.P.S Aerykck has even delete my comment that you were referring to, so I guess it is moot, anyway. I've watched my points drop a little every time I post there, so I suppose he's banging away at the trolling button, too. I think he'd be shocked how much HIS would drop if I was that childish.

on Jul 21, 2006
Hi Cacto, ...................so are you saying that we can measure the universe and the earth below?


Not totally, but we're pretty close. We can find oil and precious minerals without digging and we know what lies beneath us and how the earth is constructed. We can determine the size, shape and rough composition of extra-solar stuff and we've been able to predict the passage of the stars for quite some time.

As you know my knowledge of scripture is limited. Are there qualifications made on that clause in the early Hebrew? Or does our understanding of the universe constitute the damnation of the Jews?
on Jul 21, 2006
generally don't come down hard on people who believe in the inerrancy of the Bible in daily life.


Really? Well you have here. You may be surprised to learn that I as well as most in our congregation believe in capital punishment. And as far as politics, there isn't alot in scripture but to obey the laws of the land. It's mostly moral not political that comes up here. Like for instance, abortion, stem cell, homosexual marriage, divorce. Most of these things end up in the politcal arena, yes, but they are moral and ethical subjects that are politicized. BTW being a biblical Christian, I'm against all these things knowing that these things serve only to hurt us.

The fact that you posted this one in current events makes me believe this goes beyond "belief" i.e. religion for you.


Well this is about Israel. They are the current event of the day wouldn't you say? Many do believe, as I do, that the evening news is like reading the prophetic scriptures also so I guess I could have put in in either one.

so I suppose he's banging away at the trolling button, too


hahahah I never hit the trolling button even once......even to those that hate me and let me know all about it constantly. But I think you did come down pretty hard on him.......but you do me too.....and I haven't blacklisted you.......yet!!! ..... Actually I'm not into that. I felt like it a few times but refrained......not you but someone else. But I'm all about open communication.

Also, on the Koran thing......that's not too far fetched imo. I always believed we were going down, just not sure how. Maybe from within like Rome.

Or does our understanding of the universe constitute the damnation of the Jews?


no there are no clauses here. There is no total damnation of the Jews in scripture. If you look at the passage in question you see that God is saying that these ordinances are a sure way of showing his faithfulness to them. I don't think we are anywhere close to measuring the solar system right now if ever. They keep finding new galaxies from what I read....and I'm not an expert on astronomy....so maybe someone else can enlighten us here.

on Jul 21, 2006
"Really? Well you have here. You may be surprised to learn that I as well as most in our congregation believe in capital punishment."


People in everyday life don't invite comment on their beliefs normally. When they do, I give the opinions they ask for. When you post to the forums here, and then pretty harshly compare your beliefs to other peoples, you invite dissent. Aeryck is bottomless in his condemnation of the US death penalty.

You characterized evolution as a religion and now present the fact that we'd better be supporting Israel so God will bless us. Evangelicals in America are trying their darndest to effect public policy based upon their idea that the Bible is inerrant, and want all the quirky resulting ideologies to impact our policy.

So when you promote creationism as equally valid as evolution or propose that our nation will prosper if we support the current incarnation of Israel, I ask why. You say because the Bible tells us so. Is it that odd to you that people, weighing the prospect of seeing their nation led by a book, would demand to know on what authority the Book speaks?

If scientologists, biblical literalists, whoever want to believe what they believe personally, fine, I have no problem with that, as silly as I might believe it to be. When they take it a step further and start imposing their will on the law, the government, etc., based upon those beliefs, though, I have a say since it is my country too. If you are going to suggest a change in the way our nation as a whole behaves, then you open the discussion of the merits of your argument.
on Jul 21, 2006
If you look at the passage in question you see that God is saying that these ordinances are a sure way of showing his faithfulness to them. I don't think we are anywhere close to measuring the solar system right now if ever. They keep finding new galaxies from what I read....and I'm not an expert on astronomy....so maybe someone else can enlighten us here.


Sure, but look at the quotation again:

If heven above can be measured and the foundastions of the earth searched out beneath I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, says the Lord."


The problem is though that this is increasingly being done. We are measuring the heavens and searching out beneath the foundations of the earth. I think the Jews should be worried if they take that sentence seriously. They'll be cast off any century now. Sure, new galaxies and star systems are being generated all the time from the centrepoint of the universe (apparently every galaxy is moving away from that point at a roughly even speed) but with the increasing in computing speeds there's no good reason we won't eventually be able to map everything we can see in the heavens. Most of that's been done for a while. Let's just hope there aren't any Jewish astronomers or geological surveyors out there.
on Jul 21, 2006
but if you think evangelical Christians who believe in the revelations version of the end of the world are mainstream, well, you need to venture into the mainstream a bit more.


Baker I am not sure what you mean here...I do "venture into the mainstream." Every two to three years I move to another part of this country and go into many many churches looking for a church home.

They all preach Revelation at some point.

You are right in that no one knows the day or the hour....and most of the other details are speculation.....

But I've never until today heard the 144,000 witnesses as anything other than that.

I was using LeHaye as an example because even if people don't agree with the way he sees the end times, they haven't called him a liar and banned his books. Most see it as possible ONE way it can all come about.

There is nothing that makes me cringe more than those people who go around giving seminars and speeches on the end times.

What about now?

Tomorrow can take care of itself.
on Jul 21, 2006
When they take it a step further and start imposing their will on the law, the government, etc., based upon those beliefs, though, I have a say since it is my country too. If you are going to suggest a change in the way our nation as a whole behaves, then you open the discussion of the merits of your argument.


would you like to start on history next Baker? Let's start with the 37 volumes of Washington's letters for a start and see how much changes have happened in 200 years. ......and it's not going "my" way believe me.

We all fight for what we believe in. We put an x in the box that best represents our worldview. I put an x on those things that best represent a biblical worldview. I believe alot of things are happening because many with the opposing worldview are winning and changing or making our laws. We almost had federally funded stem cell research voted in this week. I would be against that....but guess what? It's only a matter of time. Most likely the next prez will vote it in.

It's already happening at Harvard.......this is where we're going. This is, imo, going in the same direction that Hitler did with his medical experiements he did during the Holocaust.

Link

No, Baker, the evangelicals are losing this war......not winning it. But of course having that biblical worldview, I understand this is going to happen. Jesus said to expect it....so I'm not all bent out of shape here. But I've read the end of the story......we win!!! So I don't mind losing so much now although I still do the right thing by doing my part now. I vote.

Cacto,.....you're a hot ticket. It's looking like you're not in favor of the Jews here. I'm hoping this isn't wishful thinking on your part. I think we're smart stuff too, but I'm pretty sure God made this promise with the belief that it ain't gonna happen. You have to read the whole thing in context. Go to Jeremiah and read chap 31.




on Jul 21, 2006
Cacto,.....you're a hot ticket. It's looking like you're not in favor of the Jews here. I'm hoping this isn't wishful thinking on your part. I think we're smart stuff too, but I'm pretty sure God made this promise with the belief that it ain't gonna happen. You have to read the whole thing in context. Go to Jeremiah and read chap 31.


I don't believe in the god of the old testament and to be honest I don't think many Jews do, let alone Christians. Most people would rather leave the fire and brimstone for them that want it. But for those that do the advances of science in the fields of astronomy, cosmology, navigation, geology and scanning technologies must be a source of considerable worry. I find it odd that people can live believing that sort of thing. I would consider it extremely ironic if it turns out that only the Amish and the poorest 3rd worlders make it to heaven (them being the only ones ignorant of astronomy and geology).
on Jul 22, 2006
I don't believe in the god of the old testament


Why not? Do you believe in the God of the NT?

Most people would rather leave the fire and brimstone for them that want it.


There's quite a bit of fire and brimstone in the NT. Read Revelation sometime.

I would consider it extremely ironic if it turns out that only the Amish and the poorest 3rd worlders make it to heaven (them being the only ones ignorant of astronomy and geology).


me too!! God gave us brains and he intended we use them. It's not supposed to be "check your brains" at the door type of thing. He said he wants us to love him with our whole "heart", "mind" and "soul."
on Jul 22, 2006
When they take it a step further and start imposing their will on the law, the government, etc., based upon those beliefs, though, I have a say since it is my country too.


I don't think anybody disagrees with you. After all, when you vote, you're trying to force your own politics on others. Otherwise, you wouldn't vote to have certain things done in government, because not everybody agrees with you, and it's their country as well. Same with anybody else who tries to be represented by their representatives.
on Jul 22, 2006
Sure, new galaxies and star systems are being generated all the time from the centrepoint of the universe (apparently every galaxy is moving away from that point at a roughly even speed) but with the increasing in computing speeds there's no good reason we won't eventually be able to map everything we can see in the heavens.


Didn't people also say we'd have flying cars by now?

I would consider it extremely ironic if it turns out that only the Amish and the poorest 3rd worlders make it to heaven (them being the only ones ignorant of astronomy and geology).


I don't understand why it'd be ironic or even surprising. I'm a bit of a pragmatist, so I think if they can live their lives well without such knowledge, then such knowledge would be pointless for them (unless it's just a hobby).
on Jul 22, 2006
"Why not? Do you believe in the God of the NT?"


Nothing new about that. There have been people like the Albigenses who believed that the God of the old testament was really satan, who defied God by making himself a world full of people to be God to. The real God supposedly took pity on us and sent Jesus to set us straight and give us a way to redeem ourselves.

People think the beliefs of today have always been the main beliefs, but I think if the average Christian hopped around in time they'd be shocked at what they'd find. The subject of this blog, i.e. revelations and such, has only been in vogue for a little over a hundred years since the big surge of interest in mysticism and prophetic religion in the mid-late 1800's. If you read about the time, you find that a LOT of our modern beliefs are not much older than that.

"I don't understand why it'd be ironic or even surprising. I'm a bit of a pragmatist, so I think if they can live their lives well without such knowledge, then such knowledge would be pointless for them (unless it's just a hobby)."


I think his point is it would be ironic if they'd be the only ones that go to heaven BECAUSE they don't know those things...
on Jul 22, 2006
Nothing new about that. There have been people like the Albigenses who believed that the God of the old testament was really satan, who defied God by making himself a world full of people to be God to. The real God supposedly took pity on us and sent Jesus to set us straight and give us a way to redeem ourselves.


It reminds me of the many different ideas of evolution people have. Many interpretations of the same data, but not all interpretations are equal.

I think his point is it would be ironic if they'd be the only ones that go to heaven BECAUSE they don't know those things...


Personally, I think it'd be just as ironic (and make as much sense) to consider the idea that only big-breasted redheaded babes that I find hot go to Heaven (and me and my family and friends of course).
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