Or is it?
Published on November 19, 2007 By KFC Kickin For Christ In Blogging
An interesting thing happened today. Very interesting. In fact, to us it was quite unbelievable. Well, not really, because we know who's behind all this. God is funny how he arranges things. We were definitely "set up."

We were going to attend our friend's church for our first Sunday here, but a miscommunication arose. That, and the fact I'm slow moving in the morning made for a change in our plans. Since we were not going to make our friend's church in time, we decided to check out one we found on the net. So I called my friend and asked if she wanted to skip her church since I wouldn't be able to get dressed in time for hers and she said yes. This church had a later service.

So we picked her up. We walk into this, what turned out to be, brand new building 10 minutes or so from our new home. This just so happened to be the congregation's first Sunday in their new building. Interesting I thought. Our first Sunday in our new home and their's as well. We noticed the congregation was tiny, only about 36 or so people. My husband counted about 80 chairs set up. These Southerners were very friendly to us Northerners, many of them coming up to us even before we opened the door.

We sit down. My friend opens the bulletin and nudges me. She points to the name Clyde Billingsly who is the featured speaker wondering if he's related to the singer I met last year, got to know a little bit and collected his CD's. "I don't know" I said. "Maybe I'll ask later after the service."

I noticed there was no mention of a Pastor in this bulletin. No Pastor? "You don't suppose? Naaahhhhh this is way too soon" I whispered to my friend. So we enjoyed the sermon. To us the service and sermon were very short. It was over less than an hour from when it started. My husband would have just left if I didn't decide to go up to see if Clyde was related to Charles. I just had to ask I told my husband, for the heck of it. It would bug me to no end if I didn't. So I did. "Yes," he said. "Charles is our son."

Wow. So I went on to tell him that my son attends Liberty (this speaker is involved in the DLP at Liberty) and how we met his son a couple of times and seen him perform many times. I also told him how we moved to FL unsure what God is doing with us but knowing we are being led. After talking with him a bit, he rushes me over to meet his wife, introduces me and we get to talking. As we're talking my husband is talking to the worship leader who has the job of filling the pulpit. Clyde's wife (Charles' mother) and I have a nice conversation that ended with us exchanging phone numbers. She lives within a mile or two of us we found out later.

This is just too cool. Not only meeting them and all but they are going on the cruise with us in January. So my husband comes over after finishing speaking with the worship leader and I introduce him to Charle's mom. The look on his face was priceless. He mouth dropped open. "Charles' mom?" "Yep." I guess he just figured the name was coincidental when he saw Clyde's name in the bulletin.

In the meantime, my husband was asked by the worship leader to fill the pulpit for Christmas and New Years. Unbelievable. We weren't even supposed to be in this church. A little miscommunication and a lazy me (not an a.m person) was directed by a knowing God who used these things to put us in the right place at the right time.

When we left our church back home, one of the reasons given by my husband was he felt he wasn't the man to bring our church through a much needed building process. We had grown expedientially and we were/are squeezing ourselves right out of the rented building that we have been in for the last five years. He had no desire to get involved in this type of tremendous doing. He even felt that maybe our lack of obtaining land had something to do with his lack of desire in going thru with such a huge responsibility. He felt that maybe he was in the way of what was to come. So we respectfully gave our resignation and in the space of about two months are now in Florida having a strong feeling we needed to be here.

So today, we walk into a church with a brand new building after already going through the building process and they have NO PASTOR. Unbelieveable. Of all the churches in Florida (two on every corner practiacally) we end up in one with NO Pastor. Unbelievable (if it weren't for God).

We have no idea what this means yet. He has a fulltime job with a CPA firm. One which he will honor. But he will most likely accept their invitiation to guest preach these two holidays and just see what the Lord has in mind here.

With God all things are possible. It's not really unbelievable.


Comments (Page 1)
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on Nov 19, 2007
As far as I can tell, after a building program, a lot of pastors burn out. It's a tough process and if you don't have the right people involved it can go very badly. If you're really lucky they built with cash.
on Nov 19, 2007
As far as I can tell, after a building program, a lot of pastors burn out. It's a tough process and if you don't have the right people involved it can go very badly. If you're really lucky they built with cash.


I admire pastors who go through the process, however, I often wonder if God meant for us to spend so much of our focus on buildings. I think He cares far more about souls.

I'll put in a prayer for you guys, KFC. This sounds like it could be a remarkable opportunity!
on Nov 19, 2007
If a building can help you reach souls, Gid, isn't that a good thing? The amount of people coming to our church, the programs we can now have that we couldn't before due to space limitations and no yard, I think that buildings are very important. But if God wants you to build, he'll put the right people into place, and he'll give the Pastor the right leadership for the time and the right mind for it. Pastor had been leading our church for 16 years before it was the right time to build. He didn't spend those 16 years stressing about buildings, either.
on Nov 19, 2007
This is NOT to say that not having a building is a terrible sin and will hurt your ministry - just in the case of my personal experience with going from a store-front to a church, it was important, and it was time for it.
on Nov 19, 2007
If a building can help you reach souls, Gid, isn't that a good thing?


Does it help you reach souls, though? I don't think so. I think oftentimes (not always), a building project comes in direct conflict with our mission to go and make disciples, jythier. We try to make fortresses, sanctuaries against the world rather than living IN the world, as we were called to do.

If a building helps reach souls, I have to wonder about the sincerity of their commitment.

Please don't take this as an outright disagreement, jythier, just food for thought.
on Nov 19, 2007
Our church just had an event two days ago it could not have done without the space that is attached to the new building. New people were in church due to this event, and souls were saved. The building itself is built such that it can be used for concerts, events, etc, to reach out to the community.

But that doesn't relieve the responsibility of going out and finding people where they live. The building is just an extention of outreach, and a place to get together.

Also, the stewardship of money issue comes in. At some point it is more economical to own a space than to rent one.

Not to mention that the Time to Build campaign touched numerous lives in itself throughout our church, before the building was even built.

But, yeah, I can definitely see a church going through a building campaign for the wrong reasons, and having it interfere with the mission. But, as you said, it doesn't always. I've only been through one building campaign after all, it just happened to be a successful one for all involved (I think).
on Nov 19, 2007
sounds like G-D put you guys there for a reason.. the reason became apparent.. it's always good when you listen to G-d.
on Nov 19, 2007

Hey!  I just wanted to say if this was a story, I would never believe it!  But then truth is stranger than fiction!

So way to go and best of luck!

on Nov 19, 2007
As far as I can tell, after a building program, a lot of pastors burn out. It's a tough process and if you don't have the right people involved it can go very badly. If you're really lucky they built with cash


Back home we have a great group of committed people who will make this happen. But my husband is more concerned with saving souls than building buildings so this had no appeal to him. He's not the "norm" when it comes to Pastors. He could care less about money and numbers. It is quite an ordeal tho and I'm surprised with the burnout factor although I'm not aware of this since we've never been put in this situation.

I think He cares far more about souls.


exactly Gid. We'd just as soon meet in a nice big tent. It doesn't really matter to us. A nice building is nice, but we must not lose our focus.

I'll put in a prayer for you guys, KFC. This sounds like it could be a remarkable opportunity!


Thanks Gid. I appreciate it. We'll see what happens here. I still can't get over this whole thing....as I'm listening to Charle's CD's..hahahahah.

If a building helps reach souls, I have to wonder about the sincerity of their commitment.


I don't have a problem with a nice simple type building but what gets me sometimes is the money spent on lavish monster structures when so many people are hurting and starving. I know this is a debatable area I'm in, but it just gets me to wondering. The Temple of Solomon comes to mind.

I feel the same with these Taj Mahal's we build today for our schools. I've seen too many in Maine that just made me shake my head and wonder what the heck we're doing.

sounds like G-D put you guys there for a reason.. the reason became apparent.. it's always good when you listen to G-d.


yes, and we're on an exciting adventure. Stay tuned!!



on Nov 19, 2007
Hey! I just wanted to say if this was a story, I would never believe it! But then truth is stranger than fiction!So way to go and best of luck!


Me either! I felt like I was in the middle of a movie. It was unreal. Truth is tranger than fiction.

Luck? Luck? ohhhhhhh you mean.........L-iving U-under C-hrist the K-ing?

Yes, thank you! I will!

on Nov 19, 2007
My church isn't a monster structure, it's got enough room for the church now with a Phase 2 that will make it bigger if we need it, so there's room to grow. But the space for events is what I was excited about. However, the inside IS lavish. State of the art sound equipment, lights, a stage... I know they want to make it look nice and sound nice. But if people are just there for a show, and aren't even worshipping, what's the point? If the room went from being filled with the sounds of worship to a silent crowd, why did they bother? Sometimes I think that, although the Pastor seems to be on the right page, the church as a whole is missing the mark somewhere - and I wonder if someone didn't convince Pastor that all that equipment was needed to get people into a church these days. So what if it is needed? If people need a church, they're going to come to a church regardless of the sound quality or whether there are lights. Or whether there are projection screens in the front that have movies playing behind the lyrics - what's up with that, anyway? It's distracting. Why can't we just have a screen with the words on it?

I don't think I really want to be attending my church anymore, and I've felt that way for a while. I'm a simple kind of guy. I don't need all that fancy stuff, I don't need fellowship to be filled with conversations about nothing.

On our fancy projection screens the other day, they showed a clip from Schindler's List (never seen it) where he notes that he kept a car, which was worth a certain number of lives, and a pin, which was worth 1 or 2 lives... and I'm thinking, we have this projection screen, the projectors, the lights, the massive amounts of materials possessions that probably don't enhance the experience of corporate worship at all, and we could have saved how many souls? Met how many needs? Or is it better spent invested in getting people who are worried more about a flashy church into a building so they can hear about Jesus? I don't know, but I know God knows what He's doing and He'll use the building to the best of it's ability to reach people, just like he would have used all that money for whatever other purpose it might have gone to. And that's really the point.
on Nov 21, 2007
But if people are just there for a show, and aren't even worshipping, what's the point?


This is actually starting to be debated at length lately. Recently the very well attended Saddleback Church started asking this same question after years of being a very large seeker friendly church. Lots of programs but they were seeing no results. Nothing but numbers. People were just as lost as they day they walked in. No personal spiritual growth to be had. So the leaders of this church have come forward to apologize for what they deem to be going in the wrong direction.

Yes, they were bringing them in but it was nothing more than a show. They were entertaining the people, not feeding them.

On our fancy projection screens the other day, they showed a clip from Schindler's List


This never should have been used in the worship time. I've heard/seen this stuff before. Down South years ago, alot of the churches were pushing "A Purpose Driven Life." At one service the Head Pastor sermonized the whole lesson on Chapter 1 of Rick Warren's book. Shameful. I told the Assistant Pastor, when he took us out to lunch, I was offended. Nothing but the word of God should have been on that pulpit. I was not happy. He actually agreed with me. How could he not?

It was a glass pulpit and a very large church (2 services) and you could clearly see both the bible and Warren's book side by side up there on the pulpit. I had recently read the book and could recognize that he preached exactly out of chap 1 of this book.

There should be not competition between the bible and other secular books even if they are based on scripture and there should be no competition between one Pastor and church to another. I have to believe Pride is behind all this. Get them in, get them baptized and count the numbers. Do what it takes.

Shameful.

on Nov 21, 2007
Yes, they were bringing them in but it was nothing more than a show. They were entertaining the people, not feeding them.


See, and I've been saying this for years, but have gotten a lot of hostility for saying it.

There should be not competition between the bible and other secular books even if they are based on scripture and there should be no competition between one Pastor and church to another.


I got in trouble in one church because I was managing the church library and would not put "The Prayer of Jabez" on the shelf because I didn't agree with the doctrine. My feeling was that if I am running a church library, every book in there is implicitly endorsed by me, and sonce that book was readily available at the public library, I saw no need to put it in mine.
on Nov 21, 2007
I thought Saddleback got so far off the mark that they decided Jesus wasn't the only way to heaven anymore? Have they gone back to the Bible yet?

Our church got heavily into the Saddleback programs, but recently distanced from them again.

The movie was used to illustrate a point at the end of the sermon, but Pastor does use a lot of movies to illustrate points at times. He definitely speaks out of the Bible but then uses whatever illustration he can find, which I think is OK. He didn't preach a message on the movie - the movie accentuated the message. Why is that bad?
on Nov 22, 2007
Our church got heavily into the Saddleback programs, but recently distanced from them again.


I think alot of churches got sucked into this including Liberty. We never did. One of the reasons is we are far from the South which just jumped on board and another is we know somebody who knew something about a program in this church which was stolen from another. Long story.

The movie was used to illustrate a point at the end of the sermon, but Pastor does use a lot of movies to illustrate points at times. He definitely speaks out of the Bible but then uses whatever illustration he can find, which I think is OK. He didn't preach a message on the movie - the movie accentuated the message. Why is that bad?


I'm not saying it's bad Jay. I've never heard of this done before but my son said he has. I'm just not sure about using the entertainment industry in a worship service. I'm sure there are pros and cons to such a thing. I'd worry a bit about abuse of this and also the image that maybe God's word needs a boost to impart a thought or teaching. I guess this would be one of those things that is very subjective and debatable but not necessarily unbiblical.



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